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#1 Kayles7

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Posted 28 August 2012 - 09:25 AM

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I saw something about this on the news this morning and I discussed it with my moms boyfriend because this I really have strong feelings towards. I don't think it's right for people to get arrested because they have helped someone commit suicide. If you wanna commit suicide then you should be able to and, unlike some people, they can't do it on their own so they need help. I don't agree with it at a certain point, for example, I don't agree with young teenagers or adults commiting it because they have so much to live for but what if your really ill and can't do anything with yor life anymore. What's your views on assisted suicide and do you agree that people who help assist suicides should get arrested? What's your views on people committing suicide by themselves as well?

#2 yunapolaris

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Posted 28 August 2012 - 01:04 PM

For people committing suicide on their owns, I strongly am against it. Committing suicide is the easiest way to get out of troubles in life but also the most selfish, stupid & coward-like way.

For people who assist suicides, I understand your point of view. I don't know much about how the laws work in the case, but I mean how you can prove to the laws that the person gave you the permission to kill him or to help him kill himself? Say, he left a hand-writing suicide note, but how can you prove that you didn't actually put a gun in his head and forced him to write it?
If the suicide is extremely ill and in a vegetable life, and there's no hope to revive him , I believe it's legal to have the doctors put him to rest..
But if he is just really ill, but still conscious, and still can move, even barely, there're many ways to kill himself on his own, rather than asking for help. And the person getting asked, should have try his best to help him get rid of the suicide or simply refuse, rather than take that responsibility on his shoulder.
So yeah, I can say that I agree with people getting arrested for assisting suicide.

#3 Kayles7

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 01:30 AM

I agree that suicide on your own is an easy way to get out of life and the most selfish, coward way ever but what if your loved one had passed away. Sometimes people have break downs or go insane because their partner or son/daughter or any family member I guess has died. And what about teenagers who are constantly bullied but are too afraid to help because, unfortunatly, that happens and they believe that suicide is the only way to get out of it. I never thought about that if the person didn't get the permission to help kill the person and I think that is a very good point. But what about people who want to commit suicide and can on their own but choose to get help with it. I watched a documentry at school before about Terry Pratchet and he wanted to have an assisted suicide but he could walk and everything but he didn't let his wife help, however, because she would get arrested for assisted suicide so he had to go to Switzerland. I don't know if he did die that way but I think that if you want to have an assisted suicide then it should not be llegal. I understand what you've said about what if they didn't get permission so I think that it should be legal if you go to an assisted suicide place and your family's there to say good bye but I guess it's already illegal in the way you have said because I believe that that is murder.

#4 yunapolaris

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 12:00 PM

^ For the bullied teenagers you mentioned, if they really have no other choice rather than committing suicide, and their parents/siblings/friends totally ignore them and don't care about them at all to notice that something wrong & help them, if their life was THAT miserable & horrible, then yes, it'd would be okay for them to free themselves from this life. It's their life after all, they can do whatever they want with it.

The thing about assisted suicide is that, if it's legal, it would create a gap in the laws that bad guys can take advantage of it, you know what I mean. Like, I wanna kill some one, but I manipulate them to write a suicide note mentioning that they allow me to assist them to commit suicide, but the truth is that it's me who wants to kill them, does it make sense?
Like self-defense laws, it's being taken advantage of so many times. The laws already have many gaps, I don't think it's a good idea to create some more.

Plus, I still don't understand why would any one ask for help to commit suicide? If you really determine to do it and so ready to die, why need help to do it? Say, you're too scare to kill yourself, so you will pass that huge responsibility on one of your friends/beloved ones around you?
If you needed help to kill yourself, I don't think you're ready to die at all, why bother?

#5 Kayles7

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 02:47 AM

I understand now why it is illegal thanks to you lol but people who need assisted suicide, I'm not sure why they need help but maybe it's because they don't want their death to be gorey e.g. jump out a window and break your bone or slit your wrists and there's loads of blood. In Terry Pratchets documentry, he travelled to Switzerland for an assisted suicide because it's legal over there and they have these like hospitals where they help you to kill yourself and I think what they do is just put you to sleep, like dogs and cats, because they have whatever it is to put you to sleep unlike regular people who don't have that so they instead jump out a window or whatever and create a mess.

#6 orangebear289

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Posted 31 August 2012 - 04:36 PM

i think the assisted suicide you're talking about is euthanasia which is very different than what yunapolaris is talking about. Euthanasia is for the times when someone is basically a vegetable and would rather die (like, taken off the machines) than to have the costs build up on their family members. That is a totally different case and I believe the laws around it pretty strict. Probably something like, you need to have it written down or have told the hospital in advance. Plus i believe the "putting to sleep" thing falls in the euthanasia category as well.

BUT I agree with yunapolaris on the other subjects of assisted suicide. It is dumb on both parties and I don't even see why it exists in the first place. In that case, there should be laws enacted on it just to make people rethink their actions.

#7 yunapolaris

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Posted 31 August 2012 - 08:38 PM

I understand now why it is illegal thanks to you lol but people who need assisted suicide, I'm not sure why they need help but maybe it's because they don't want their death to be gorey e.g. jump out a window and break your bone or slit your wrists and there's loads of blood. In Terry Pratchets documentry, he travelled to Switzerland for an assisted suicide because it's legal over there and they have these like hospitals where they help you to kill yourself and I think what they do is just put you to sleep, like dogs and cats, because they have whatever it is to put you to sleep unlike regular people who don't have that so they instead jump out a window or whatever and create a mess.

i think the assisted suicide you're talking about is euthanasia which is very different than what yunapolaris is talking about. Euthanasia is for the times when someone is basically a vegetable and would rather die (like, taken off the machines) than to have the costs build up on their family members. That is a totally different case and I believe the laws around it pretty strict. Probably something like, you need to have it written down or have told the hospital in advance. Plus i believe the "putting to sleep" thing falls in the euthanasia category as well.

BUT I agree with yunapolaris on the other subjects of assisted suicide. It is dumb on both parties and I don't even see why it exists in the first place. In that case, there should be laws enacted on it just to make people rethink their actions.

In the case of Terry, he was diagnosed with Alzheimer -which currently has no cure, so I understand that he wanted to kill himself before the disease gets worst. And actually, if he had come to the US, he could have done it, because - in these states to be exact: Washington, Oregon & Montana, PAD (Physician aid-in-dying) or assisted suicide is legal .

However, euthanasia is illegal in all of US, and a lots of countries - which I don't really agree with. Because in my own family, my uncle got into an horrible motobike accident and he's in vegetable life now, he doesn't move or talk, just laying in bed... And we can't do nothing to release him from the misery.. His body keeps getting swollen..

Anyway, I understand why they make it illegal thou... The key difference between euthanasia and PAD is who administers the lethal dose of medication. Euthanasia entails the physician or another third party administering the medication, whereas PAD requires the patient to self-administer the medication and to determine whether and when to do this (-from wikipedia)
So, people who gets euthanized, they are unconscious, thay had no say in whether they wanna die or not, and the decision of putting them away just solely comes from the family - who might want to release him from pain or who just wanna get rid of a burden, you know..

The people getting PAD or assisted suicide, they decide to do it on their own. And like said above, they will need to apply the lethal dose on their own, so technically they kill themselves.

#8 Kayles7

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Posted 31 August 2012 - 11:35 PM

I'm sorry about your uncle. And in England any form of assisted suicide is illegal. Even suicide itself is illegal cause what am you going to do if they do commit suicide? Put their body in jail? I don't think so. But I agree with everything that you people are saying and I thank you for your comments. I enjoy discussing things with you than just my moms bf because I get more opinions and information which is a lot better then getting it from your school because some of the teachers learn you based on their point of view which I don't like. And I agree with what you had to say about that it should be legal for families to be able to decide to pull the plug on a family member if they are in a vegetable state and it should be legal if they have an incurable illness to make the decision of assisted suicide or something. Also I never knew America allowed assisted suicide.

#9 hinachan

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 12:59 AM

People commit suicide because they have pain that is far beyond what any judgmental person can comprehend. It's easy to condemn someone when you haven't been in their shoes. Anyone who thinks a person who commits suicide is a coward needs to look down the barrel of a loaded gun, into a bottle of pills about to be swallowed, and ask themselves...do I have the COURAGE to pull that trigger, or take these pills, slash that wrist, or put that neck into the noose?

No. Because we chicken out (= we're cowards). Those unfortunate, tortured souls who commit suicide have more courage than the rest of us. I'm honest enough to admit that I don't have the guts to face any form of death, because I'm a 100% yellow-bellied, fearful coward. I feel we should do our utmost to help anyone feeling suicidal, but it's inaccurate to call suicide a cowardly act.

As for euthanasia, I've always been upset by laws preventing it. We don't know what kind of physical agony is involved in having a terminal illness, so who are we to judge? It's pretty horrible that we have the compassion to put our pets out of their misery when they're terminally ill, yet we force Grandma and Grandpa to suffer till the bitter end, out of our own selfish desire to hang onto them. (And by "our", I mean society in general, not anyone in particular.)

#10 Kayles7

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 02:42 AM

People commit suicide because they have pain that is far beyond what any judgmental person can comprehend. It's easy to condemn someone when you haven't been in their shoes. Anyone who thinks a person who commits suicide is a coward needs to look down the barrel of a loaded gun, into a bottle of pills about to be swallowed, and ask themselves...do I have the COURAGE to pull that trigger, or take these pills, slash that wrist, or put that neck into the noose?

No. Because we chicken out (= we're cowards). Those unfortunate, tortured souls who commit suicide have more courage than the rest of us. I'm honest enough to admit that I don't have the guts to face any form of death, because I'm a 100% yellow-bellied, fearful coward. I feel we should do our utmost to help anyone feeling suicidal, but it's inaccurate to call suicide a cowardly act.

As for euthanasia, I've always been upset by laws preventing it. We don't know what kind of physical agony is involved in having a terminal illness, so who are we to judge? It's pretty horrible that we have the compassion to put our pets out of their misery when they're terminally ill, yet we force Grandma and Grandpa to suffer till the bitter end, out of our own selfish desire to hang onto them. (And by "our", I mean society in general, not anyone in particular.)

I understand what you're saying about people who commit suicide do it because they are in pain but some people do do it because they are cowards. For example, some people may commit suicide because they may be financial debt or something and they can't pay them back the money. They are a lot of different reasons why people commit suicide. Not just because they are in pain.

#11 yunapolaris

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 07:00 PM

People commit suicide because they have pain that is far beyond what any judgmental person can comprehend. It's easy to condemn someone when you haven't been in their shoes. Anyone who thinks a person who commits suicide is a coward needs to look down the barrel of a loaded gun, into a bottle of pills about to be swallowed, and ask themselves...do I have the COURAGE to pull that trigger, or take these pills, slash that wrist, or put that neck into the noose?

No. Because we chicken out (= we're cowards). Those unfortunate, tortured souls who commit suicide have more courage than the rest of us. I'm honest enough to admit that I don't have the guts to face any form of death, because I'm a 100% yellow-bellied, fearful coward. I feel we should do our utmost to help anyone feeling suicidal, but it's inaccurate to call suicide a cowardly act.

As for euthanasia, I've always been upset by laws preventing it. We don't know what kind of physical agony is involved in having a terminal illness, so who are we to judge? It's pretty horrible that we have the compassion to put our pets out of their misery when they're terminally ill, yet we force Grandma and Grandpa to suffer till the bitter end, out of our own selfish desire to hang onto them. (And by "our", I mean society in general, not anyone in particular.)

Totally agree with you on the euthanasia. You've said it all.

However, I respectfully disagree with you on calling committing suicide 'courage'. It's more like hopelessness than anything else. If they have that big of a 'courage' to pull that trigger, why don't they have the courage to face with whatever they are going thru? Is it really no other way rather than killing yourself?
And I don't think it's being courageous at all. It's being motivated. In their mind, they are motivated by the escape of the pain/misery they are in, the pain of the bullet going thru their brain is nothing compared to what they are facing. And it takes less than a minute to escape like that, rather than dealing with the problems - which take a lot longer. They'd choose they easier & faster way.
You & I will not pull that trigger because we are not motivated, we have to desire or motivation to do it at all. It doesn't make us cowards. We're dealing with this tiring life, we don't choose to run away, it's pretty brave, imo.
Don't get me wrong, in case they have some untreatable diseases or the life is indeed miserable like the teenager we used as an example above, had no friend, no love, no care, no nothing, then suicide is THE only way. After all, it's their life, they can do whatever they want. You're right that we can't judge. I respect their choice, but it doesn't mean I have to like it.

#12 Kayles7

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 01:03 AM

But what about if the person is insane and they commit suicide? What would you call that cause I don't have a clue.




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